Not surprisingly, The Dark Knight has done sublimely well at the box office. We knew it was going to happen, but maybe we didn’t know just how well it was going to do. Given the way the world works, however, this means that there will almost definitely be a third movie in Christopher Nolan‘s reinvention of the Batman franchise.
And according to an article over at MTV, Nolan and his co-writers — brother Jonathan Nolan and David Goyer — have already discussed the theme and villain for a third movie.
But of course, no one is saying anything, which leaves us to speculate.
WARNING: CONTAINS SPOILERS
The overriding theme that we got from TDK concerning the future for Batman was that he and Gotham City were going to be at odds. This was brought to the fore during Batman’s conversation with an upside down Joker, and leading right into the final scenes between Batman and Gordon. Being chased into the shipping crates by Gotham’s finest’s canine unit and their human handlers, Batman is now the villain in a city which has just lost its white knight, Harvey Dent.
And this is not something that is new to the Batman universe, where oftentimes he is painted as a criminal vigilante. So in all likelihood, a large portion of a third Batman movie under Nolan’s direction will focus on Batman having to hide from the law. But just like Gordon’s young son, there will be those in Gotham that know that Batman is innocent of the crimes labeled against him.
But Batman versus Gotham is not going to be the title of the next film; there needs to be a villain. But this villain has to allow Batman the chance to redeem himself in the public eye. Enough must be put on the line, at stake, that Batman’s sacrifices and struggles to bring whomever to justice will allow him to be the hero that Gotham needs.
Add in to this equation the need to keep a measure of reality to the villains, and your list continues to diminish. Because as much as I love the Riddler or Bane, I can’t see them appearing in a third Nolan movie as Batman’s big enemy.
I’ve been asking my Twitter-peeps who they think will be making a return for the third movie, and the one answer I keep getting is Two-Face. Now I was at once saddened when the movie finished that they had killed off Harvey Dent. However, I was soon alerted to the possibility that he wasn’t actually dead. Nothing is said on the scene of Two-Face’s fall from the construction site, and the need to keep him redeemed in the eyes of the city was what sent Batman running in the first place, so it isn’t a huge leap to think that they faked his death and locked him up in Arkham Asylum.
So write Two-Face in as the number one choice of fans. But there are others, two in particular that have all of a sudden seen an opening in the position of “female lead”: Poison Ivy and Catwoman.
Catwoman will never play the big bad villain, and for good reason. She is a very talented burglar, but she’s not going to be vying for world domination or committing mass murder anytime soon. So she will play a small role in the next film, of that I am sure. She will be Bruce Wayne’s love interest and Batman’s constant annoyance in a city that doesn’t like either of them, which in and of itself will make for some fantastic scenes.
But in my movie, I would have Bruce Wayne and Catwoman forced into partnership by the evil doings of one Pamela Isley, aka, Poison Ivy.
Though the fantastical element of Ivy’s ability is to control plants and the like, take a step back and what you have is a fan favorite villain who is out to protect the planet and its plants. In this day and age of environmental awareness, the idea of making a movie where the main antagonist is trying to protect a city by destroying it is not a big leap to make. And even if Nolan and Co want to drop the attachment to realism, Poison Ivy still manages to be one of the better villains in the pages of Batman.
You’ve heard what I and my Twitter-peeps have to say, let’s hear what you have to say. The comments are just below, leave as long a reply as you would like. We would love to hear what you think. Who should be the villain(s) for the third Batman movie?
I would like to see Liam Neeson come back– I think that would bring everything full circle.
Comment by Jerry — July 22, 2008 @ 6:41 pm
The problem is that Batman’s villains are generally very campy or silly, because all the good ones get locked up or wrecked by the Bat. The most realistic villains that I would think fit the movies would be Black Mask or Hush, although the latter might have required some set up in the first movie.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman_villains
Comment by Luke — July 22, 2008 @ 7:24 pm
I think Two-Face should return. The story could not only be about the Batman’s redemption in the public eye, but about Harvey Dent’s redemption as well, bringing the tale full circle. It would also give Mr.Eckhart his turn in the spotlight.
Comment by Lamont Turner — July 22, 2008 @ 7:35 pm
Why not the Riddler? The Joker in the first Batman was no where NEAR what this Joker was… so create a new version of the Riddler. Team him up with two face and bam. And is there not going to be a Robin anymore? I wouldn’t blame them, Robin was a stupid character. I didn’t like the end to the movie, Batman running I mean. And I don’t think Harvey is dead either. One of my friends said that since the Joker didn’t die that they should bring him back… but to do it without Heath Ledger would do no justice. His performance was nothing less of SPECTACULAR. THAT was what the Joker should have been like all along. A psychotic yet intelligent murderer. Amazing. Conclusion… Riddler and Two Face. What about Freeze? And these movies are too “dark” for a Poison Ivy return… and Cat Woman was stupid.
Comment by Robby — July 22, 2008 @ 8:21 pm
I agree about the possibility of having Poison Ivy and Catwoman in the final film. Several things would have to be taken into serious consideration first of course. Catwoman would have been done extremely well. Nothing like the horrible Halley Berry attempt. I feel odd saying this as well, given how much I love him, but Tim Burton’s approach to Batman wasn’t as spot on. It was extremely stylistic and Michelle Pfeiffer certainly gave Catwoman a memorable touch. Her character would have to stay true to the idea of Catwoman while giving it Nolan’s brilliant gritty and realistic, original flare. All in all, it could end up being more trouble than its worth. The idea of Poison Ivy though would be very interesting. Damage control from Joel Schumacher’s hyper colored dragqueen-esk Poison Ivy would be vital to the success of the character but I think it could be worth it. She could be something along the lines of a up and coming, fanatical, eco-friendly terrorist. I picture military intelligence. A perverted mixture of Bio chemical warfare and extreme environmental thinking and Maybe give her some small tie into the realm of Gotham city or a nod
Comment by Chris Ables — July 22, 2008 @ 8:28 pm
toward a character from the previous films, something to bring things full circle. Another interesting idea would be to pit her against Batman with the assistance of Ra’s al Ghul’s daughter, Talia. In the comics, She was big part of Bruce Wayne’s/batman’s love life who was constantly torn between batman and her father. Nolan could have her and Ivy team up somewhat similar to the way Dr. Crane and Ra’s al Ghul did in “Batman Begins” in an attempt to finish her father’s work. With a partnership along those lines, there would be a lot of creative ways to create sexual tension, drama, and Nolan could almost literally do anything with the other criminal characters such as the mob bosses and such. Whatever Christopher Nolan does though, if anything, as long as it remains in the vein of the last two films, while raising the stakes a bit, it should be just fine.
Comment by Chris Ables — July 22, 2008 @ 8:37 pm
I could see the Riddler as actually a very good villain for a 3rd movie, albeit as more of a Zodiac type serial killer who leaves clues that leaves the victims of Gotham terrified. Much in the same vein as Hancock, you’d have a police force and city that would not necessarily be quick to embrace Batman so much as willing to do ANYTHING to get rid of the Riddler.
I just wish that the 1st movie hadn’t wasted the concept of Arkham’s inmates being sprung loose, as that in itself would have made for almost an entire movie with Batman being run down in trying to save the city from destruction at the hands of tons of madmen. Obviously you’d need someone running the show a bit like when Bane when he did that in the comics, but Bane probably never could work in a mainstream comic movie (as the visual just doesn’t work unless you go Hulk-esque with the CGI). Plus, as I said before I don’t think the concept of Arkham’s inmated being freed would seem that big a deal due to the first film.
Not sure I’d want to see the Penguin, Killer Croc, Mr. Freeze, or Poison Ivy, unless they were just secondary characters like Scarecrow was. The return of either R’as Al Ghul or Two-Face would make for better accepted mainstream villains, simply because people already know them. If you brought back the former, then you could also bring in his daughter Talia as a love interest for Bruce Wayne.
Let’s just hope the 3rd here turns out better than it did in the last Batman run of films.
Comment by RRanney1 — July 22, 2008 @ 8:44 pm
I think Catwoman should definitely be in it. And Black mask because so far in gotham city it is focused on gangs and gang lords so black mask would be perfect.
Comment by Angelo Cotto (huge Batman fan) — July 22, 2008 @ 8:53 pm
The Riddler. They gave him a bad name in Batman Forever, but a darker reinterpetation of his character could be great. If you stick with the redemption theme in the third movie, then the villian would need to be someone so clever that Batman would be the only person who could keep up with him/her. Like the Joker, his motives would not be based on financial gain, but on creating mayhem. I doubt the Riddler would be as sadistic as the Joker, but then he would have the intellect to create enough disruption that the city would start preying on itself. Also, if the Riddler was an expert with technology, parallels could be drawn to modern society’s reliance on technology and what happens if someone could turn it against us.
Comment by JJ — July 22, 2008 @ 9:01 pm
I would really like to see the Riddler in the third movie. If they do go that way it would be really cool to see Jim Carrey replay that role. The way they model this Batman series to be based more towards our own world, the scenery, the acting, almost all aspects of the earlier series from Nicholson to Schwarzenegger are different and geared more towards reality in this series. It would be real interesting to see how well Jim can follow Ledger’s performance as the Joker and to see how he can change his previous performance as vibrant as it was, to a darker personality.
Then again the Joker didn’t die yet….
Comment by Nick — July 22, 2008 @ 10:03 pm
Even though the joker got caught i would like to see him return in the third batman as the super villian. like you said with making two face not dead and joker and two face teaming up would be great. that would help batman with his redemtion. i love the joker and if he returned that would be the shit.
Comment by bubba — July 22, 2008 @ 10:44 pm
Your saying was very interesting, i have been looking for a spoiler that actually made sense, My thought on it is your absolutely right about two-face , even though i think i believe in it much more then you do it seams. I think with out a doubt its going to be Harvey Two-face in the next film. Aaron Eckhart has not proven him self enough to be a good two-face, as in he didnt have the sadistic side to him. Yeah he was killing peaple but where was the crazy laugh everytime he fliped the coin there was just heartace in him and revenge … no i just wanna kill batman cuz its my life objective, and thats going to be the plot in the next film. One other thing is i think your wrong about the Ridler. I can deffinently see him as a head villian because i dont care what anyone says , Edward Nighma or however u spell it was without a dought the main villian in Batman Forever , and hes just as evil and wants to kill batman just as bad as the joker. Not to mention he could add some good laughs as Heath Ledger did in this one
Comment by nick salerno — July 22, 2008 @ 10:50 pm
I think Talia Head is my primary vote for love interest AND anti-villain, alongside resurrected daddy. He’s already rezzed once by doing the fake out in Begins. Or… she could claim to be the new Ra’s, bringing about a revenge of the League of Shadows. That would bring the trilogy to a full circle. It could also be revealed that they also supplied the Joker and his gang with the necessary funds to pull the huge heists they did. It was already hinted at in the first movie that they were pulling the strings from the beginning. This would also keep it very dark… and League also means… MORE NINJAS. Batman must save Gotham from ninjas. WIN for everyone!
Comment by Slipstream — July 23, 2008 @ 1:14 am
As much as I want Harvey Dent to be alive with the “fake death” angle, I think it might viewed as tired. Keep in mind Gordon faked his death.
You can’t keep having people fake their deaths to tug at heart strings. So maybe Harvey Dent wasn’t dead, just nearly dead (like in Princess Bride).
Comment by Sara — July 23, 2008 @ 8:52 am
Also… no wayy is it going to be the Riddler. The Riddler, a jokester of sorts, is too close to the same character type as the Joker.
I definitely think the next villian, like the Scarecrow, will be one of the lesser known characters. So think outside the box.
Comment by Sara — July 23, 2008 @ 8:55 am
This discussion really points out how shallow Batman’s rogues’ gallery really is. When you get past the big guns, you get sillier and sillier.
I like Catman. When he’s first spotted, hint that he might actually BE Batman in a different color scheme, but it will soon become obvious that he’s a different man. His bold day-friendly orange and yellow costume underscores the “I’m not trying to hide” aspect. He’s clearly stealing the “Gotham’s hero” role from Batman, but to what ultimate purpose?
Comment by Daniel — July 23, 2008 @ 9:33 am
I disagree with every except Luke. Black Mask would be perfect because in Batman Begins and Dark Knight, the movies only focused on the gangs that are tearing through Gotham City. I do not think Riddler and Two Face and the other best villains should be in it because when Mr. Nolan would want to come out with the fourth movie it would be extremely difficult or the story line would go extremely slow and it would be boring. Lets say he has already used up the good villains, what’s next? Maxi Zeus or the Ventriliqouist would be the only ones left. Those arent top notch. Two face should come back in the sixth movie or somethin because everyone loves awaiting for a villain that they no isnt dead. You want to keep the hype going. Just let things go smoothly.
Comment by Angelo Cotto (huge Batman fan) — July 23, 2008 @ 11:08 am
We should all just face the reality that there is no hope for a 3rd movie being anything close as good to this last one. The joker was going to return in the 3rd movie, this was merely his introduction to the world of batman. Of course heaths tragic death has left nolan with the choice of recasting the joker or bringing in a new villian, off a very short list of believable characters…its foolish to think that someone like catman or hush could suffice, the mob of mindless moviegoers wont even know who the hell they are. And to the idiot that said they should use jim carrey as the riddler, you sir, are a douchebag.
I see a re-cast of the joker, heaths performance was nothing less than brilliant, but it was the creation and bringing to life of this character that was such an amazing achievement for him… it wouldn’t be completely unheard of for someone to take a shot at bringing the role that ledger created back to life.
and the last guy who said they should bring two-face back in a 6th movie?? 6th?… you really think it’ll drag that far? what is this starwars? haha c’mon man..
Comment by thedarkjared — July 23, 2008 @ 1:02 pm
I forgot all about Talia, but she would make a good romantic foil and could pose a legitamate threat, borrowed from her father.
One minor villain that I came up with, that would be an oddball choice, but a possibility given the recent Gotham Knight cartoon, would be Deadshot. Think about it, fairly cool visual, realistic power set, and a largely unknown character (to non-comic fans) that the creators could use for whatever story they wanted to tell. Not likely, but not outside the realm of possibility.
And here’s my never going to happen prediction; Liam Neeson returns as Ra’s Al Ghul, and he brings a new protege with him, one Jean Paul Valley, otherwise known as Azreal. Like I said, never going to happen, but wouldn’t that be a crazy story to do?
Comment by Henchman21 — July 23, 2008 @ 1:06 pm
Easy, Black Mask and Catwoman. Nolan had already written The Black Mask in at some point, but was cut. He’d be a perfect follow up to the Joker in demeanor and tactics. It’s really a no-brainer if they decide against Two Face.
I think it will also be important to have one or two cameo villians (similar to how the Scarecrow was treated in this film).
Daniel,
That’s absurdly off base. The fact that Batman has more than a couple of villians that could fit in the gritty, realistic world of Nolan puts him above and beyond any other mainstream Superhero. Christopher Nolan’s Spider Man? I don’t think so.
Comment by Leslie — July 23, 2008 @ 1:48 pm
i hope you all have not forgot about Harley Quinn. If you have, she is the jokers sidekick and wife. In The Dark Night we hear the joker talk about his wife in the story how he got his scars. i understand its one of many stories he gives but he did bring it up. Its safe to say, she could be in the next movie. She is also responsible for breaking the joker out of jail in the comics. And where is our joker now? I also believe the Ridder will be cast in the next film. Im not sure if this would be my choice but ill tell you why i think this to be true. When Batman is being black mailed. Who is it by? Awnser..Mr. Reese. kind of sounds like Mysteries dosent it. Our friend also had red hair, and played in the scene with Anthony Michael Hall. Who was all over the internet for rumors of playing the Riddler. Maybe they were just mixed up with the two. The only thing is, i wouldnt understand that casting pick. Who was the actor anyway, a nobody. Seems like they could get anyone they wanted to sign on to play that role. I guess will just have to wait and see.
Comment by finalword — July 23, 2008 @ 2:51 pm
i think that they shud bring 2face back because he didnt have a as big a role as what i think many people wud like to have seen him in. theres no way that they wud bring the joker in because they cannot replace heath ledger, which wud make the movie a complete bust. the idea of catwoman is great too, giving bruce wayne somewhat of a love since rachel is dead. but i wud love to see two face and the riddler team up… my third pick wud have to be mr freeze if one of them wasnt there tho
Comment by george — July 23, 2008 @ 3:19 pm
I agree with a few of the other comments suggesting the Riddler would work well in Nolan’s Batman interpretation. You could make a dark, sadistic character that commits crime on a large scale using the mentality and schemes similar to the killer from the Saw series.
Comment by Justin — July 23, 2008 @ 4:56 pm
Poison Ivy? You’ve got to be kidding me. Bane and Riddler are “too silly” for the Nolanverse, but a plant-woman isn’t? Sure, she can be an environmentalist, but then your antagonist would just be Pamela Isley, not Poison Ivy.
And Catwoman? What criminal in their right mind would start a career in robbery in a city protected by an outlaw vigilante that thinks he’s above the law? I wouldn’t jaywalk in Gotham, much less steal jewelery.
Read IGN’s take on B3. They’ve done a much better job hypothesizing.
http://movies.ign.com/articles/892/892656p1.html
Comment by Anthony — July 23, 2008 @ 6:37 pm
My fantasy team up is the Riddler (who is a brilliant scientist) employed by Lex Luthor (Kevin Spacey). This would set up a World’s Finest movie.
But it would never happen. . .
Comment by JoNuggs — July 23, 2008 @ 7:54 pm
I agree with poison ivy. Only real possibility imo. The others are way too silly.
Comment by M — July 23, 2008 @ 8:02 pm
The Scarecrow character was great in the first film, and he is still alive, bring him back in a big way, he never got the full movie he deserved, his role was minor in the 1st movie.
“there is nothing to fear, but fear itself”
Comment by Matthew — July 23, 2008 @ 8:05 pm
I think Riddler should be in it and I’ll tell you where to find the version of Riddler that should be considered. Forget all the campy versions of the riddler we’ve seen, go back to the graphic novel by Frank Miller: The Dark Knight Returns. There’s a very sinister, but composed Riddler that is NOTHING like what we’ve seen in the previous movies, TV show or even the comic books that have come since.
That is the version of the Riddler that should be portrayed and I think Johnny Depp would be awesome for that role, just going back to the way he has acted in somber, sinister roles in the past, and the way he looked as Charlie Chaplin, of course there would be some differences, but the look is there. Before you comment no on the riddler, go pick up the graphic novel I mentioned and then offer your response.
Comment by ciphun — July 23, 2008 @ 8:12 pm
How about Johnny Depp as the Riddler?
Comment by Justin — July 23, 2008 @ 8:14 pm
ssh, nobody tell bubba that Heath Ledger died.
Comment by dood — July 23, 2008 @ 8:18 pm
Mad Hatter
Comment by billy — July 23, 2008 @ 8:20 pm
I was talking to a friend after our second viewing of TDK in a row about who could possibly replace Heath as Joker because honestly if two-face came back it would make this movie pointless Batman does everything in this movie to protect Harvy Dent and his image so if two face comes back then everything they were talking about in the latter part of the movie becomes null and void. Back on topic one possible casting choice for Joker is Johnny Depp, for whatever reason while I was watching the Joker scenes I kept getting a feeling of Depp style acting, I think Heath took cues from him in his development of the role, if anyone could pull it off I think it would be Johnny Depp.
Comment by C7 — July 23, 2008 @ 8:21 pm
I see the riddle and the joker teaming up in the next movie, as we all know the joker got away and if they could depict a more mature riddle i think that would be an awesome combination. I doubt that two-face will come back but I do see cat woman teaming up with batman two take on the villain duo.
Comment by Nicholas Curtis — July 23, 2008 @ 8:25 pm
Why has nobody mentioned Azrael? He is a worthy opponent, and fits the new series of Batman movies PERFECTLY. The Dark Knight vs. The Angel of Death, both at odds with Gotham Police. Azrael could even start by taking vengeance upon the Joker in Arkham, to tie the loss of Ledger in. The battle scenes could be unbelievably amazing, and the overarching themes would be brilliant.
Comment by Lincoln Lourens — July 23, 2008 @ 8:29 pm
The first movie was about fear. This movie was about fear realized and giving way to paranoia. What happens when paranoia proves true? It leads to wrath. The city wants Batman…he’s responsible for everything that has happened to it: the Narrows, the Joker, the death of the cops and Harvey Dent (he’s dead, look at the last shots and you see his chest is not moving).
The villain in the next movie will either be an invention or someone who can personify the wrath of Gotham. My vote is Bane…but you get rid of the wrestler mask and comic book super-steroids. In fact, I would put Tiny Lister in as Bane, which gives him a moral foundation the audience can relate with while making him Batman’s foe and the champion of Gotham’s wrath.
However, the next movie is also the last one. It will establish the status quo between Batman and Gotham. Batman is a necessary evil in Gotham, a city so corrupt even the garbage men are paid off. Gotham may not like him, but it needs him. They’ll come to acknowledge this in the third movie and it’ll define the roles everyone will play for the rest of Batman’s life.
At least, until he retires and everyone comes back in 20 years to do Nolan’s version of The Dark Knight Returns.
Comment by Dukrous — July 23, 2008 @ 8:29 pm
Poison Ivy doesn’t make any sense to me in this more-realistic world Nolan has created. An ancient organization pledged to wipe out evil in the world: I’ll buy it. A scientist who’s their puppet: sure. A psychopath that comes out of nowhere, so crazy he paints himself as a clown: still with you. A man forever scarred by a choice that someone else made: got it. A woman who has some ability to *control* plants: Huh? That does not compute. Nor does the idea of a man in some crazy spacesuit with a weird ice fetish. Half-man, half-penguin hybrid doesn’t work either.
And Riddler wasn’t in Dark Knight Returns, or any of Miller’s Batman stories.
Comment by Andrew — July 23, 2008 @ 8:48 pm
Poison Ivy and Catwoman, awful choices! Could easily bring Bane back just as are narcotics abusing Mercenary maybe with a past as a veteran of multiple foreign wars, cast in the public eye as the good guy. I’d personally like to see Freeze, come back less as a hulking monstrosity in a freeze suit and a more calm cool intellectually unstable sociopath with a freeze gun.
I’m not sure why you think this has to be ‘real’ and completely believable since in the first movie the ‘Scarecrow’ rode a subway through the city with a giant microwave in it that managed to evaporate ONLY water.
My personal belief on the next antagonist will be the true Scarecrow. Making several cameos as the narcotics dealing ‘paranoid schizophrenic’ I think he’s the most likely choice for villain in the next movie.
I’d love to see Bane back though, if they made him an Actual good guy with a gritty secret and misguided cause, it would force batman into an interesting predicament. Kill the public’s new chosen hero, further losing the trust of the city he fights to save or run forever.
Comment by Ryan — July 23, 2008 @ 8:57 pm
to follow along with the ganster/ mob theme, i think black mask or scarface would be a good addition to the nolan films. nolan could do very much with the derangements of scarface. or at the very least, make him a secondary character to ra’s alongside talia…
i also disagree with many people that say that bane would be a difficult character to do… if you follow along the knightfall storyline, i think that nolan could make this a very believable character. he doesnt have to be insane cgi like hulk, because in knightfall he wasnt insanely bigger than batman:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f8/Bane-breaks-Batman-497pg21.png
maybe he can do a lou ferigno type deal with bane, and have him an above normal size guy. this would also bring a very shocking conclusion to a casual batman fan to see batman fail at the end of the movie…
Comment by faiz — July 23, 2008 @ 11:00 pm
I know he was a really minor character in the series, but a realistic character could be the ventriloquist. He is a psychotic everyman who has a dummy telling him what a who to kill, he fits perfectly into the one of the inmates who escaped arkham. Now I’m not saying he needs to be the main villain but he would be a nice compliment distraction to batman battle with whoever is the main villain.
Comment by liljon425 — July 23, 2008 @ 11:06 pm
I think with the death of Ledger, The Joker should be back but to give Gotham a Better class of criminal as a mentor or fasilatae multipule villians ie..Two Face, Riddler, Catwoman, Scarcrow, Bane, Ivy, a sort of meeting of foes to the bat and the dark side the depression created in the first movie forced into hiding by the second, With the bat public enemy #1 they tend to come back around, Like the first two they need to be dark, smart and of our reality!
Comment by Jhawn — July 23, 2008 @ 11:15 pm
I’m of the opinion that Poison Ivy does not fit very well into the Gotham Nolan has created. Whereas The Riddler may have a chance, obviously not as cartoony though.
Other than The Riddler, I could imagine Hush, Black Mask and Talia al Ghul as front runners.
Comment by Ryan — July 23, 2008 @ 11:18 pm
My friends and I had an interesting idea! Bring back Jim Carrey as the Riddler! Now he’s got a bit more acting chops and has a more recent movies that have been a bit darker. Just throwing that out there.
Comment by Ching — July 23, 2008 @ 11:20 pm
I know it’s a smidge old skool, but what about The Wraith? The “anti-Batman”…would allow Nolan to keep his universe free from the really, really superpowered types that he’s done a great job of steering clear of for now. (I just don’t see Poison Ivy manipulating plants in the way he’s conceived the universe…maybe it’s just me).
Plus, the Wraith would allow a great springboard from which the Dark Knight could become Gotham’s hero again.
Comment by Greg — July 24, 2008 @ 12:01 am
I’d love to see the penguin. Any thoughts? He pretty much made the animated series.
Comment by Andrew — July 24, 2008 @ 12:23 am
Ok I’m not one to break dreams but if we’re talking about the vilans of Gotham City we must go back to The Dark Night. First off Catwoman couldn’t bring the mayhem that Nolan has put into these new Batman flicks, and Poison Ivy… seriously? No way either, but if we look into The Dark Knight and the man who supposedly knows who Batman is he is about to die in a car collision when Bruce Wayne saves him and everyone gets the understanding that his lips are sealed… But big whoop why do I bring this up? His name is the entire reason I bring this up, anyone remember it? Give-Up… its Mr. Reese aka Mysteries aka The Riddler.
-My 3 Cents
Comment by I doubt it. — July 24, 2008 @ 12:23 am
I think the Penguin could defiantly make a come back. I would also love to see a stripped down realistic Riddler.
An Environmentalist Terrorist Poison Ivy could be really cool too. But I don’t think Hollywood has the balls to paint environmentalism in a bad light.
Whoever it will be, I would like to see them as a hurdle to an increasingly safe Gotham. The fact that things were getting better in Gotham, that there was a ray of hope in TDK was pretty cool.
Comment by David — July 24, 2008 @ 12:27 am
I also want to give a big Amen to RRanney1. The riddler as a zodiac killer type character could be fantastic. I like him because I think batman is at his heart more of a detective then a superhero and the Riddler forces him to think.
Comment by David — July 24, 2008 @ 12:36 am
I think the Reaper should be the villain and they should use year two as a bases and possibly bring in the riddler as a cerial murderer
Comment by Graham — July 24, 2008 @ 12:57 am
dude, no spoilers in here. poison ivy is the most ridiculus character, shes not gonna be in it. Christopher Nolan isnt into doing the cheesy characters like other directors were like using robin, mr freeze, ivy, etc. Not to mention he has not included “super” powers into the movies.
Comment by gansch — July 24, 2008 @ 1:52 am
I think that poison ivy or the riddler would be the only logical choices. who should play those parts? i cant think of anyone for poison ivy but what about Paul Bettany for the riddler?
Comment by nick — July 24, 2008 @ 2:08 am
no votes for clayface, huh?
i think it could be done frighteningly well with today’s sfx and if the character resembled the empathetic version seen in the animated series it could work. toss in another vigilante in catwoman, one who has lesser scruples than batman, and there you go… a path to public redemption but one that’d still feature the depth we’ve come to expect from nolan’s series.
Comment by s — July 24, 2008 @ 2:15 am
I rather like the idea of bringing in Azrael, who first encounters Batman while on a mission to kill an arms dealer (Nolan’s Penguin?). The Sacred Order of Saint Dumas could be used to reconnect with the League of Shadows storyline and to bring in Talia Head, though I would caution against retconning Bruce Wayne’s seven years in training in Batman Begins to establish a true-to-the-comics pre-existing relationship. Better to reconfigure the storyline from the comics to preserve the consistency of the films. At any rate, bringing in Talia Head as a new love interest would help us bury the apocryphal Rachel Dawes character.
I also like the idea of a darker version of the Riddler along the lines of the Zodiac killer, but in the end I have to agree with Sara that he bears too strong of a resemblance to the Joker, even (or especially) if, as Justin suggested, he’s made out to be something like the killer in Saw, subjecting his victims to difficult life-and-death choices.
Comment by Badda Being — July 24, 2008 @ 2:25 am
Black Mask would work well in Nolans Gotham. He os the kind of sadistic villain that could follow in the Jokers footsteps although his motivations would be more traditional villain motiviations like money and power.
I think the Riddler would also work extremely well if done right. They can give him a darker personality and make him similar to the zodiac killer like someone else mentioned. Another possible way to utilize the Riddler is the way that he has recently been portrayed in the comics. Introduce him as a private eye that is seen as someone attempting to step into the void left by Dent to do some good, have him going after Batman with the public on his side while he really has a more sinister motive.
If they do recast the Joker Johnny Depp would probably be the best choicealthough i also think that someone like Javier Bardem could also pull off the role althought this role will always belong to Heath.
Also i’m almost positive Catwoman is in the next one as indicated by Luciuc Fox.
Comment by The Historian — July 24, 2008 @ 2:49 am
There does kind of need to be a love interest, which suggests either Talia al Ghul (hard to have her without Rhaz though) or catwoman. An interesting spin would be to include the detective Riddler that has been in the newer comics while Batman’s making nice with the above badgirls.
Comment by Flint Wood — July 24, 2008 @ 3:07 am
joker transcend into a “character” that never shows it face, but scheme and weaves through the use of “riddles” to manipulates Gotham against a batman that’s struggling to come to terms that he’ll be alone in the dark, maybe forever. i also agree with the idea of wrath, both from Gotham by manipulation and also Batman’s inner demon which is Bruce wayne’s struggle to succumb to the temptation of vigilante (by joker’s riddles) against up keeping the institution that is the “Batman”
Comment by zenichi — July 24, 2008 @ 4:01 am
it has to be superman… all of gotham will ask the man of steel to catch the caped crusader… and now its the showdown between the biggest boys in comicdom
Comment by maxratul — July 24, 2008 @ 5:25 am
I’ve got 2 takes.
1. Riddler. But as has been stated, not Jim Carrey Riddler. Think Kevin Spacey from Seven. The insiduous terror that a Serial Killer could inspire would be a direct 180 from the chaos and explosions that both the first and second movies used to instill a sense of dread.
2. Something along the lines of Bane + The Reaper. Bane comes to town and begins wreaking havoc, batman tries to take him out, bane beats him (breaks his spine…)… Batman is hoeld up whiel the city is gripped in fear of this rampaging madman. The Reaper comes to town and kills Bane. While Batman is recovering The reaper goes on cleaning up Gotham in his own way. Batman has a crisis of faith. Gotham is the safest its ever been now that The Reaper is out on the streets. Whammo.. an innocent gets killed.. Batman has had enough. The Reaper and Batman meet, “Break a few Eggs” monologue ensues. Tada! Sequel!
Comment by Gustogus — July 24, 2008 @ 6:22 am
I think Bane.
Comment by Dick Grayson — July 24, 2008 @ 8:53 am
The Zodiac, or a Zodiac-like killer or Se7en. Nolan should create a new “villian”, but one that’s so outside the box of traditional Batman/superhero movie villians that it immediately takes the audience into new terroritory. Think Zodiac (the movie, starring Jake Gylenhaal and RDj). The city is terrorized by a mass murdering gunman and Batman must be, not a street fighter, but a world class detective (his one TRUE talent).
Comment by Brian — July 24, 2008 @ 9:11 am
This was a terrible article. Catwoman and Poison Ivy???? Are you serious? That would be the most terrible movie ever made and it would have the possibility of being worse than Batman and Robin. I don’t know anyone who would be excited to see Catwoman and Poison Ivy (maybe as side/filler characters but main villian?) The great thing about Batman is that there are so many villians who would be great for Nolanverse and could use the image revamp. I would be happy to see Riddler. And I think Harley Quinn would be great as a side story. Imagine a sick twisted love story between the Joker and Harley(but who the hell could fill for Ledger’s great performance)? But I wouldn’t mind seeing Bane or Pengiun but not as the main villian. My votes (in order) are for Riddler, Harley Quinn. Bane, Penguin, Black Mask. And I know we’re all crossing our fingers for Arnold returning as Mr. Freeze.
Comment by Todd Seal — July 24, 2008 @ 10:33 am
The Riddler and Two Face.
The Riddler – played by Phillip Seymour Hoffman.
Epic.
Comment by Johnathon — July 24, 2008 @ 12:58 pm
Given that this movie ended with Batman as a criminal, and Gotham left in total chaos (including Gotham’s crime syndicate), the city is ripe for new leadership on both ends of the spectrum.. I think a combo of Riddler and Hush (suits Nolan’s asthetics perfectly) would be great.. since it would also dig a little into Wayne’s past.. Black Mask would be a good partner for Riddler as well since he’s the mob boss type..
If they bring back Joker, its gotta be Johnny Depp – he can play either Riddler or Joker..
OK so now Wayne needs a new love interest.. Catwoman.. but instead of making her into a semi-superhero (the whole cat story of how she got her powers wont fly in the next movie) – instead, give her a bit of a cute, sexy, comical twist – she’s obsessed with cats and Batman, and she dawns this catwoman outfit by night, attempts to be Gotham’s hero in Batman’s “absence”.. yet always gets herself in more trouble than she bargained for and Batman ends up always having to save her, which she doesnt mind and in turn leads them to having hot nookie on rooftops.. a love/hate relationship..
It would be cool if they featured Arkham in the next flic.. maybe even an attempt to free Joker??..
and as far as Two-Face coming back.. ehhhhh could be cool but how much more coin flipping can u deal with? he would still need a stronger villain to guide him.. and if we are basing comebacks on visually seeing a character die then Raz Al Ghul could show up at any moment no?.. i wouldnt wanna see Two Face or Al Ghul again..
Comment by Siah — July 24, 2008 @ 1:09 pm
Ok let me paint you a picture. The GCPD are on the hunt for the Dark Knight. But, he is to hard to find. So they go the with a hired gun (Deadshot) to bring him to justice for is supposed crimes.
While in the mean time the growing group of villains brought on by Batman’s presence are gathered together by Talia al Ghul (also the love interest angle for Bruce Wayne) in the effort to revenge her father and kill the Bat. Who’s there? Well the who’s who of Gotham City villains. Gotham City’s mob boss Black Mask, The Scarecrow (was in Batman Begins), Mr. Zsasz (was in Batman Begins), The Penguin ( But more of a realistic version not the Danny Devito type), The Ventriloquist, Bane ( Tiny Lister would be perfect he did throw the detonator out the window and he is a criminal in The Dark Knight), and The Riddler ( a reinvented version much like the joker and Johnny Depp would be perfect for that.) Druing this meeting of evil they decide to create as much terror and destruction as possible to bring the bat back out to seek get the revenge that most of them seek. They go their separate ways to smoke out the Dark Knight with The Riddler being the main focus with Bane being the second most focused on. Talia will also be a focus in both the Bruce and Batman angles.
Now that we have the Players the plot is wide open. First there would be an on going battle till about half way through with Deadshot. All the while the League of villains are causing chaos throughout Gotham. Finally the people of Gotham realize they need Batman and come calling Batman. With the dilemma of helping the people that didn’t want him or letting them take care of themselves. He battles intensely with Deadshot about mid-movie. Standing over a beat and battered Deadshot only one more punch away from ending his life and it looks like he is going to break is one rule (no Killing) Batman knows right then that what he needs to do. Bring order to the chaos in Gotham starting with Bane. With the Dark Knight almost taken out by Bane he now has his eyes on finding the Riddler who has teamed up with Talia and her ninjas. Now from here you could go two ways one he takes them all out and becomes the Hero everyone loves in Gotham or (the way I would like to see) He goes head to head with the Riddler, Talia and her ninjas and they get the upper hand then Bane comes back in and finishes the job by breaking Batmans back. THE END. Hope you liked the picture I painted. This is the only way I could see topping The Dark Knight ( almost a perfect movie). I think what ever they do they have their work cut out for them.
Comment by TJ — July 24, 2008 @ 2:38 pm
I am pretty sure Catwoman is in the next film because when bruce asked morgan freeman to design the new lighter suit. Bruce asks him does it protect against large dogs? and Morgan says it protects against cats” which hit me right away that he was foreshadowing catwomen.
Comment by Richard J — July 24, 2008 @ 3:26 pm
..Did I really just read this?
“The Riddler – played by Phillip Seymour Hoffman.”
Sounds more like The Retardler.
IF they choose to use the standard Batman characters, I would like to The Riddler. However, that seems so boring at this stage.
I almost wish that Nolan would challenge all Batman traditions and incorporate new elements and villians.
Plus, he please tone it down on the Bat armor? Christ. It’s getting ridiculous.
Comment by Gimme A. Brake — July 24, 2008 @ 3:39 pm
Oh yeah no Two-Face he was dead. You can’t top Ledgers’ performance so the Joker is out. They did make a Catwoman referance in The Dark Knight (Fox makes it about his new suit being able to handle a cat scratch) but she just can’t be saved in this version due to the hack job in the Catwoman movie. No Poison Ivy not realistic enough for this version. No Killer Croc or Mr. Freeze again not realistic. You could use Hush and Azrael but that’s about it for me lol
Comment by TJ — July 24, 2008 @ 4:26 pm
Oh yeah no Two-Face he was dead. You can’t top Ledgers’ performance so the Joker is out. They did make a Catwoman referance in The Dark Knight (Fox makes it about his new suit being able to handle a cat scratch) but she just can’t be saved in this version due to the hack job in the Catwoman movie. No Poison Ivy not realistic enough for this version. No Killer Croc or Mr. Freeze again not realistic. You could use Hush and Azrael but that’s about it for me lol
Comment by TJ — July 24, 2008 @ 4:26 pm
sorry for the double post lol
Comment by TJ — July 24, 2008 @ 4:28 pm
No one has mentioned Killer Croc or Clayface. Both pivotal characters in the graphic novels. Croc would play well into the psychological warefare storyline that Nolan has hit us with. His struggle with the duality of his humanity/creature exterior would play well in the event that they don’t bring back Two-Face. Clayface is simply a cool character that could be brought to life beautifully with today’s technology.
Comment by KC — July 24, 2008 @ 5:36 pm
I don’t know if anyone suggested this, but if Nolan does bring in the Riddler, a cool idea for his story could be this. Since there is a strong similarity between him and the Joker, his story could be that he is trying to be the “copycat” Joker. Build on that and you have a pretty interesting Riddler if you make him a supporting villain.
Comment by Chris — July 24, 2008 @ 6:12 pm
Daniel Day-Lewis as the Joker.
Comment by PC — July 24, 2008 @ 6:53 pm
They should definitely continue with Two-Face. He was just getting started and there’s no way that they’re not already setting him up for the third movie. If they didn’t mention death and went to all that trouble to hide Harvey’s “two-face” he’ll definitely come back. The Riddler would be cool only if he’s a real psychotic and not all campy like Jim Carrey’s version.
Comment by loveerlyf — July 24, 2008 @ 6:57 pm
How about Tom Cruise as the Joker?
Comment by Tom Cunt — July 24, 2008 @ 7:29 pm
Poison Ivy (Charlize Theron) and/or The Riddler (Johnny Depp).
Comment by dm — July 24, 2008 @ 8:16 pm
I’m getting bored of the “city in peril” concept. It was excellent in Dark Knight but I’m hankering for a different story.
Comment by Jason — July 24, 2008 @ 8:30 pm
i would go for clay face, impersonating people like gordon bruce and such making holy hell on a covert level and killer croc as a subtrarainian canniable like in the toon and manbat as a well meaning science project gone horribly out control forcing gotham to accept batman and his methodology all with two face and thwe joker revealed in the final scenes as the master puputers.
Comment by korollocke — July 24, 2008 @ 9:57 pm
catman, he fought batman to a standstill back in the day. deathstroke could also be fun as well.
Comment by korollocke — July 24, 2008 @ 10:17 pm
only way i could see bringing a joker incarnation back is joker 2.0 that not even my choice , but tryin to just replace heath is ludicrous his performance was truley one of a kind…..
Comment by impster — July 24, 2008 @ 11:52 pm
robin williamsss shud be in the batman movie :P
i dnt kno which villain but his role on the movie one hour photo is scary dont u guys think??
Comment by BatBoy — July 25, 2008 @ 1:24 am
My previous comment being unclear I shall expound. I would prefer a story line that forces Batman to come to terms with his own neuroses. Perhaps something along the lines of G-Mo’s “Arkham Asylum”. That would open up the rogue roster and include characters who would not necessarily have the ability or desire to put the entire city at stake. I’m thinking, Selina Kyle, Victor Zsaz, Oswald Coblepot.
Comment by Jason — July 25, 2008 @ 1:52 am
On the Joker:
Although there were plans to bring the Joker back in the 3rd film, they were scrapped after Ledger’s death. And the big argument out there is: should they re-cast him and follow through with their original plans? I think they are smart not to bring him back for a number of reasons:
1. Nobody will be able to play the character the way Ledger did. Some other actor can either mimic him, which would be silly, or try to re-interperet the character their own way. Somebody out there may even do a good job, but talk about spitting on Ledger’s grave. the man left us with an image of a real life joker that we as Batman fans should burn in our memories. If ever you asked yourself what the Joker would be like terrorizing your real-life hometown, now you know.
2. THEY DON’T NEED TO BRING BACK THE JOKER. As we all know, the battle between Batman and The Joker is eternal. they are going to fight/balance eachother for the rest of their lives. They love eachother! In the end of Dark Knight, the joker has that wonderful upside-down monologue all about just that. How they’re going to be doing this for a long time. Not to mention the “You complete me” line. So we had a great 2.5 hour film of “Batman vs. the Joker” and at the end it is IMPLIED that their battle will never stop. That’s all you need in the celluloid world. You have one great film, and if you want to see more joker stories, PICK UP A COMIC BOOK.
On Two-Face:
They will certainly bring him back. I belive the next film will mainly be a Two Face story. As a matter of fact, I think the last half hour of Dark Knight (which was pretty much all two-face) may have been a little too long of a lead-up to the next film. Making us all think the two-face story is over. But we’re forgetting that besides Joker, Two-Face may be Batman’s most significant enemy. Someone who was once his friend and worked so closely with. someone who still has good in him. Not to mention they both look in the mirror and see monsters. Eckart was great, and I think if he was the focus, instead of a supporting character, he’ll shine.
On Catwoman, Penguin, Riddler & Robin:
ALREADY DONE! Poorly? You betcha! But they were already done. Bring some fresh storylines to the screen. The only think I would be OK with is if they did a really accurate Catwoman story. If they based her character and origin on her involvment in “YEAR ONE”, and made some really great sexual tension scenes between the Bat and The Cat, that might be cool. Catwoman is a burglar, yes, but she’s also something of a vigilante. Not totally bad, Not totally good. this would be an interesting film plot to explore, as she gets in batmans way on the rooftops of Gotham, yet after a while, he goes looking for her . .cus he’s horny and can’t help himself.
Comment by Ariel — July 25, 2008 @ 2:57 am
to see what the fisrt two movies have been like i would think that its is to dark for posion ivy and that is a bit off from the style of batman, but if the could find a legitment person to play jocker i could see him as more of a side villian to some one else, but not bring back 2 face,becuase i didnt see him as a threatning charcter just a freak with a gun. i really dont think that cat women could play a roll. so there is the possibilty of a revised riddler.. maybe a peguin, but i think the would use freeze some how or just make a new charcter.
Comment by Brandon — July 25, 2008 @ 3:02 am
I think Harley Quinn would be fantastic. She’s so petite but insane. I know that her character is surrounded by the joker but I think a movie could be manipulated in such a way that a joker influence is there but he is not necessarily the main villian (perhaps have her doing his dirty work outside of Arkham while he is committed?)
Comment by Lauren — July 25, 2008 @ 4:08 pm
I think they should get Crispin Glover to play a villain in the next movie. Also perhaps William Defoe to play the Riddler. Ralph Fiennes is also a good candidate.
Comment by Kevin — July 26, 2008 @ 12:05 am
Don’t worry your pretty little heads, I’m sure Nolan knows what he is doing with the 3rd one.
Comment by Manfredi — July 26, 2008 @ 7:12 pm
well yes i do believe that catwoman will be returning in nolan’s third batman film. but u also have to realize that ledger had a two movie contract as the joker and so maybe theres a chance that someone else might play the main villain [joker] in the next movie.
but it’ll be a very hard task for someone to even come close to what ledger has left behind. two-face has a very close chance as becoming the main villain but we need someone crazy enough to do anything. cmon, he leaves everything to chance so i think he would be a boring main villain. u know who would make a very good but not as good as ledger, johnny depp, he does very good with sadistic characters. we’ll see within the next few months to a year to hear any new info on the next batman sequel.
Comment by robert — July 27, 2008 @ 6:13 pm
I was pretty sure they hinted at Catwoman big time when Bruce Wayne was with the Russian ballerina (the Catwoman in the 1966 Adam West movie was russian, too). Plus the comment about Batman’s suit being able to withstand a cat… And the Batman/Catwoman teamup idea is interesting too… Batman is a proclaimed enemy of the city now, so he might have to settle for a slightly shady alliance like that to remain active. OTOH, noone knows he’s Bruce Wayne, so it really shouldn’t be a problem for him to continue being Batman.
And I have to second (n+1-th, technically) Harley Quinn… she could even pick up and nurse Harvey Dent/Two-Face back to health, allowing him to come back after Catwoman or whatever other villain they bring in (I would very much like the Riddler) to do their thing first. Then she’d make him help her avenge/free the Joker.
I think that all the people saying Two-Face wasn’t Two-Face enough are missing something: What little we saw of him in the movie is less than 48 hours after he actually became Two-Face (he didn’t even have his signature coin – in scratched state – until very close to the end). He didn’t have much time yet to develop his infamous split personality, and it would be a shame if Nolan didn’t give him the opportunity to do so in another movie.
And while I’m at it, of course the Penguin, Riddler, Freezer etc. have been done before, because (as was said before) the number of recognizable villains is rather small. But the joker has been done before, too… a LOT. That didn’t stop Nolan from bringing him in, and the same might happen with the Penguin or the Riddler.
Same for Robin, btw, I was already surprised he wasn’t in The Dark Knight.
On a final note, Azrael would be a cool, if little known (to the average moviegoer) villain.
Comment by T045T — July 28, 2008 @ 4:03 pm
Something I have been considering is just how long Chris Nolan supposes he can resist the pressure of the more bizarre and surreal aspects of the mythos. Frankly, this mission of suppressing the weirder and more abstract elements of Batman’s endeavor that has guided he and Christian Bale through his first two installments is incredibly misguided. Characters such as Mr. Freeze, the Riddler, the Penguin, Black Mask, Bane, Killer Moth, Firefly, Clayface are CANON. Without them, there is no evolution to the story that supports the world of the Batman. Any true fan of the Dark Knight knows an army of writers and artists managed to handle these elements short of camp.
There is a wealth of material in the masterful “Batman – Shadow of the Bat” and “Legends of the Dark Knight” titles to borrow from, yet the logic which Nolan and Bale portray the character and his world limit their inclusion. Batman is about nutjobs, and nutjobs see and do differently than us straights.
When it comes to this current creation, I liken Nolan and Bale to Orson Welles and Joseph Cotton. As the latter team peaked with ‘Citizen Kane’, so had the former with ‘Batman Begins’. In comics, note the brilliant “Batman – War Games”, where Scarface and the Ventriloquist and several lesser heroes fit right into what, in essence, was a starkly realistic take on the world of the Batman. On that note, if Bryan Singer managed to contain, in one level of context, Lex Luthor and Lois Lane – two characters who lend themselves to camp like no others in the DC Universe – this new team should be able to handle, say, the Mad Hatter and Vicky Vale just fine.
That is, if they got over their pretensions toward ultimate realism. If the powers that be at the Warner Lot gave a comic scribe other than David S. Goyer a screenwriting gig, perhaps we could be true to the source material. Otherwise, the next Batman film could wind up featuring Bruce Wayne struggling against the billing department of psychiatrist Hugo Strange for two hours.
If I wanted realism, I’d read the Economist. Give me Batman.
Comment by BOLD SOUL — July 30, 2008 @ 11:30 pm
I’m voting for Man-Bat. Science experiment gone awry. I mean, shit, with all that buzz about the Mantauk monster washing up on shore in recent days, this could be ripe for viral marketing.
Comment by NYonce — August 2, 2008 @ 9:22 am
The Dark Knight has a small reference to Catwoman – Fox tells Bruce that the new batsuit should “even protect against cats claws”. And I think a new reimagining of Catwoman could be really good.
I think the Riddler would be way to camp – the same reason I don’t want to see Robin in this series. Plus The Riddler has always been a bit too similar to The Joker (being his protegé and all).
Poison Ivy as an eco-terrorist I could go for. Harley Quinn I love, so I’d like to see her, but again shes similar to Joker.
So in Nolan’s Batman world, I think the best fit would be Ventriloquist and Scarface. It would tie back to the release of the fear gas in the first film, making people go crazy, and it could be done in a nicely understated manner.
Or there’s Bane, who is basically just a very strong guy – no superpowers needed.
Comment by DanJW — August 4, 2008 @ 9:42 am
I would like to see more of an emphasis on masked villians in general. All throughout “The Dark Knight” they talked about Batman messing with the criminals, making it personal. Also in the story “The Long Halloween” we see a change from Mobster villians to villians that don masks and do despicable crimes.
New villians are hard to contemplate in Nolan’s realistic Batman. They have to be realistic but also strong enough to take on Batman for a whole movie.
I would say “The Riddler”
or “The Penguin”
I would like to see Nolan go a whole different direction than Burton’s Batman series though. Poison Ivy, Catwoman, Mr Freeze, Penguin, etc. they have all been done before.
Maybe a new villian should be in the mix, or a team of pyschotic villians fed up with Batman-controlled Gotham.
A new class of criminal.
Comment by Dr Orpheus — August 4, 2008 @ 12:50 pm
I too think that Bane should come back as he should have been: a calculating mercenary. I disagree with RRanney1 with the whole CGI bit. I think Vinnie Jones could play Bane really well. And I’m sorry but Johnny Depp shouldn’t be cast as Riddler. He does well in Tim Burton’s weird movies and as Jack Sparrow but he doesn’t fit as a choice that Nolan would make for this franchise.
Comment by Tom — August 4, 2008 @ 5:01 pm
I say let Gotham be the “villian”. Yes, I know. Hear me out.
The police, the government, the media, the organized crime- they’ve all turned on the B-man. To save the actual, physical city- he’s got to teach it the difference between what is right and what is just an insitution…
Which brings me to selling toys. I think this is the point in which we bring in the anti-heroes.
For that, Azreal and Catwoman at the same time would be a potent combination. Batman would be attempting to show them what he has learned from his choices in the previous films.
Azreal, incouragable as always could die not learning his lesson in the final act. Perhaps he’d tell Batman, ala the Joker, that he’s got to kill him to stop him.
Catwoman could be left a question mark. Maybe she kills Azreal at the end- driving her and Batman apart. I dunno.
If you like, throw in a Dick Grayson cameo as a young child witnessing true heroism for the first time. Maybe this would be too much- or maybe this would be a good way for which the audience to see the end of the film. A new generation of Gothamites will then inherit a better city. (Just in time for the franchise to start to suck?)
If emerging redeemed in the public eye is the plot of the story, then it only makes sense to have other characters wrapped up in that. Catwoman and Azreal are natural choices.
The Riddler… He’s always been Joker-lite, even in the comics. Let’s not start the movie off with Heath Ledger comparisons, or it will have Return of the Jedi syndrome for sure.
Black Mask is an intriguing choice, but both he and Bane are not old skool enough. That sounds like we’re having a vilian just to have a villian.
An obvious evil is what people expect. We’ve already got Bat-wannabes roaming Gotham from DK. Let Azreal and Catwoman give Batman a run for his money.
Comment by Daniel — August 8, 2008 @ 2:00 pm
it so obviously has to have rachel return from the dead, damaged and scarred by bruce’s choosing Dent over her. Rejected she resurfaces as Selina Kyle and goes about attempting to destroy both bruce and batman. That would be a great movie.
Comment by chris — August 8, 2008 @ 5:07 pm
Definitely Dr Hugo Strange. He knows who Batman is, would be a fantastic link to Arkham, and could also be the one that unleashes Two Face back on society. After all… the most dangerous villain to Batman is the one who knows who he is! Strange could also kill the Joker and thereby solve the problem of replacing Heath…. who was astonishing and couldn’t be replaced anyway!!
Comment by Tom — August 9, 2008 @ 4:55 am
I think C. Nolan would be smart enough to create an appropriately realistic spin for Poison Ivy if he chose to include her in the next movie. I don’t see her as the main villain but as an interesting side-plot, yes! See the animated series episode “Pretty Poison” which manages to show Poison Ivy in a semi-realistic light as a fanatical environmentalist/deadly Black Widow seductress hell-bent on murdering wrong-doing industrialists and the like. She could seduce Lucius Fox and poison him, thus creating another major headache for Batman in the third flick. She doesn’t have to be controlling monstrous plants(though there could be a connection between her and the blue lotus flowers used in the fear toxins in Begins).
Comment by Sara — August 10, 2008 @ 5:14 pm
These are lesser known villains but what about Lew Moxon and The Wrath?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lew_Moxon
Moxon is most famous for hiring Joe Chill to murder young Bruce Wayne’s parents (in early versions of Batman’s origin story), thus making him indirectly responsible for Batman’s existence.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrath_(comics)
The Wrath served as a sort of anti-Batman. The Wrath’s appearance and motivation are reminiscent of Batman’s, but with notable differences. The Wrath (like Batman) is distinguished by perfectionism and obsession in what he does. His costume is also very similar to Batman’s (though colored in crimson and purple with a W-insignia on the chest and cowl). The Wrath’s parents were a couple of burglars, similar to Joe Chill. They were shot by a young policeman who mistook them for committing a robbery. Due to this, the Wrath dedicated his life to a campaign of revenge against law and law-enforcers. When the Wrath finally returns to Gotham City, he comes to kill the man who had shot his parents. The Wrath’s target turns out to be James Gordon, commissioner of the Gotham City Police and an ally of Batman.
If Batman is ever to escape the label of being a murderer in the Nolan Universe, then the character of The Wrath can assist in the police believing that it was The Wrath who committed the murders in “The Dark Knight”
I think having these two characters, along with the return of Joker or Two-face could definitly form a great script based around the theme of “revenge”.
Comment by Andre — August 12, 2008 @ 12:25 pm
ooooohhhhhh Harley Quinn is a great choice! Harley Quinn as the supporting character/villain (like Scarecrow was). Just getting started maybe, making an appearance here and there, so on. And have the “main” villian be Clayface. Clayface would work out very well I think. Another “we don’t know how to fight/stop it so let the Bat do his thing… for now.” type of situation. Maybe that would prove to be a good intro for the Catwoman but… then you’re throwing alot of stuff into a single movie. Someone (character-wise) is gonna get short-sheeted… And then HQ could be brought back *if* they go for #4.
Comment by tilespace — August 13, 2008 @ 1:50 pm
Johnny Depp as The Riddler is actually very possible in the Nolan universe if you look two facts:
1) Depp is an extremely talented actor able to take on a wide array of roles and do them WELL. From Willy Wonka to Sweeney Todd to Jack Sparrow, the man is able to give a role what it needs.
2) The Riddler is not always “Joker-Lite”. The best example of this is his appearances in the 1990s animated series, where he is given a calm, cool and collected sort of intelligence as opposed to the wackiness of The Riddler.
Depp has an ability to portray calm yet captivating characters, so he if he plays The Riddler as a calm genius as opposed to a wacky genius like the Joker, the film can have a different villain and someone who challenges Batman on an intellectual level.
Harley Quinn I feel is impossible to do in this film series because of the death of Heath Ledger. They won’t recast The Joker, and without The Joker there’s no effective way of bringing Harley to the big screen. If we had dialouge explain her past and the lack of Joker, it’d feel awkward and forced, so we’re not going to see her (despite my love for the character).
The Phantasm could be an interesting character, but there would be a difficulty in Bruce falling in love again so quickly so a femme fatale that dosn’t neccesarily make Bruce fall in love but tempt him with lust makes Talia, Catwoman or Ivy legitimate choices for the next film and are almost a neccesity. We’ve seen squeaky clean Rachel Dawes, and Batman isn’t ready for love again, but he’ll have to deal with seductresses that are far different from his childhood friend. They’d serve as an excellent foil compared to the love interest from the first two films.
I think Black Mask is a likely villain because of the mob connections, his foil to Batman and the fact that he was written into the script for The Dark Knight at one point. However, I think it’s likely they’re going to fuse the character with Hush to make the character more interesting (because, let’s face it, Hush is basically an improved version of Black Mask) and the whole connection to Bruce’s past brings the story full circle.
Another possiblity I haven’t seen ANYONE mention is taking cues from the current Batman storyarc, Batman RIP. For those who don’t know, in the arc there’s a suggestions that the Wayne family weren’t such goodie two-shoes and that Bruce’s parents induldged in drugs and orgies and that Bruce’s mother had an affair with Alfred, possibly making him the father. Also, to add to the conspiracy, there are suggestions that Bruce’s Dad hired the hit on his wife as revenge for adultery and faked his own death alongside her. Of course, at this point the storyarc is ongoing and it may be true that Dr. Simon Hurt really isn’t Thomas Wayne, but there are some truly interesting elements in Batman RIP that can truly bring about a climactic finale.
The big thing to remember is that the next movie needs to be about Batman and not the villain. We need to see how Bruce is affected, we need to see emotion coming from him and we need a villain that compliments the “hated vigilante” theme, and yes, we do need redemption in the eyes of the public and the only way to do that is stopping a truly catastrophic event.
So what we need in the next movie is a female love interest to contrast with Rachel Dawes, a threat/villain that is public enough to demand public support of Batman, and something that grabs at the soul of Bruce Wayne.
So, what do get in the next film? I’d guess Catwoman as the femme fatale who steals but ultimately isn’t too evil and helps out in the end, and the “major” villain being either The Riddler or Black Mask/Hush. The Thomas Wayne story idea is great for film (maybe a 4th film), but dosn’t fit in well with the whole “Batman the outcast” scenario they set up.
Comment by BearFrog — August 15, 2008 @ 8:34 pm
The Falcone story arc can be brought to its logical conclusion, since The Long Halloween serves as a guide to this current franchise. Bring that to a head in the third movie, involving the Riddler, traces of the Joker, and possibly the debut of Hush? We’ve got ourselves a movie.
Other possibilities include the Black Mask introducing himself as the new face of organized crime in Gotham, with the mob running and hiding after the events of The Dark Knight.
Comment by copacetic — August 20, 2008 @ 4:19 am
I believe it would be a huge mistake for Chris Nolan to bring in multiple bad guys (or gals) in the third installment. Too many main characters and too many marquee names are what reduced the franchise to campy crap the last time around (post- Tim Burton).
I read earlier this month a column rhapsodizing over the possibility of an Angelina Jolie Catwoman. God help us. What a casting disaster that would be!!
A retooled Riddler would work fine in this series, but ultimately the script and screenplay along with sound casting (who would have thought Ledger would have been so brilliant) will make any chosen adversary work.
Comment by John B — August 22, 2008 @ 5:00 pm
If I had my picks for villains in the third Batman flick, it would be The Riddler, Two-Face, and Bane. Of course Catwoman would make for a good cameo and Harley Quinn would rock. But despite all that has happened, I still say that I’d LOVE to see The Joker return for a second round. That would mean recasting him. Hear me out. I salute Heath Ledger and what he has done for The Joker. He set the standards and raised the bar. But to completely remove The Joker from a third installment would deem his chaos in TDK irrelevant. You can’t just ignore The Joker. You CAN ignore Two-Face, or any other villain for that matter, but never The Joker. He’s in a league of his own. Some say recasting him would be an insult to Ledger. That’s insane, seeing as Heath Ledger ‘owned’ the role, made it his own, and delivered a stellar performance. Getting an actor to follow in his footsteps would only be an honor, and I’m sure Ledger would have wanted to character to return. Heck, we all know Nolan had plans for him in the third installment anyway.
Look at it this way; if I told you 2 years ago that Heath Ledger would play The Joker, you would’ve laughed at my notion. You would have said “Nobody beats Jack Nicolson’. Look at how things have shaped up to be now. 20 years down the road, someone will remake Batman, and The Joker will return, and someone will revolutionize the character once again. It’s inevitable. I say bring someone with the credibility and talent to play The Joker. If done right, nobody will sense the differnce although they know it’s a different actor. Allow the character to thrive. That’s the beauty of comics. What happens in the real world, no matter how bitter, cannot completely destroy a comic character.
Here’s how it goes; The Riddler is a new menace. They should make him look like the one in The Batman cartoon. He’s psychotic, but he’s also obsessed with solving puzzles. And the greatest puzzle is; who is Batman? He finds the truth somehow and knows it’s Wayne. He murders people and only lets them go if they can solve a riddle. Somwhat like the SAW movies, only not as gory. He’s just psycho…but incredibly smart. It comes to a point where Gotham needs Batman, but not even Batman can crack The Riddler’s sadistic game. He won’t allow himself to think like a madman. Gordon and Batman come to realize that they need help. In all irony, from The Joker. They go to Arkham. We see The Joker in his cell. Something like the Hannibal stories where Lecter helps the good guys from the inside. The Joker taunts and provokes the Bat, saying that he’s only in Arkham because he wants to be. Right there we see a female doctor walk in. Nametag? Harleen Quinzell. Perfect cameo! We’ll probably see a cell tagged ‘Harvey Dent’ as well.
So you see, we don’t need much of The Joker. Just a bit. Just enough to make an impact. Something to tell us that there’s no escape from his anarchy. That he can and will escape. Bane could be another villain. Someone with brut strength who overrides the mob. We need to see more physicality between Batman and his enemies. A major fight scene. And Bane’s just right for the role. Towards the end, the grand finale of the trilog, we see montage sequences…one showing Dr.Harleen walk out of Joker’s cell and leave the gate wide open. Just to tell us that he’s back, he’s out, and Gotham needs to be terrified again. There doesn’t even have to be a fourth installment. Just a sign that tells us what Batman’s life is going to be like.
Phew…that was one long rant. So my picks…The Riddler, Bane, as main villains, and The Joker along the way.
Comment by Arvindh — August 23, 2008 @ 7:11 am
Nolan will update characters when he sees fit. His flexible but not bastard like use of Scare Crow was nice. It will be riddler in the third film, but he will be a serial killer who leaves clues others can’t crack. This will show Batman playing a detective with the law on his heals interfering in his pursuit of the killer. The only thing that will scare Gotham more than the Bat is the Riddler. Poison Ivy is a terrible choice. I can only hope the 3rd Batman is not a repeat of the happening or has an agenda that has a political undertone.
Comment by john k — August 24, 2008 @ 12:29 am
It seems the most logical villain choices will be the most “realistic” characters. Someone like Black Mask or Killer Croc (His original incarnation is a thug/crime boss with a real bad skin disorder) could easily fit in Nolan’s Batworld. Any fantastic villians (non super powered) showing up have already been set up by the toxin that al Ghul unleashed on Gotham in the first movie. While it didn’t completely cover all of Gotham it did hit the Asylum and the dangerous Narrows section of Gotham. Who knows what that will produce.
You can even see probable villian set ups in the first movie when Batman is in Arkham. As he’s running down the halls Nolan makes you see that inmates are taking note of him. When Batman breaks in one of the rooms he passes a set of twins (Tweedle Dee and Dum?).
There are a lot of ways to use a lot of Batman villians in the “real world”. If you notice Nolan was able to replicate the split suit that Two-Face wears by making the suit be the one Harvey wore when he was burned (which would have been cut away in a real medical situation).
I think Dent will return in the next movie because the Joker set him on his killing spree with the premise that Dent was deceived by all those people and that, not the Joker, is what put Dent in his present condition.
If Dent has been secreted away he will find out that Batman is taking the hit for the murders that Dent felt he rightfully committed. The knowledge of that will further cement the Joker’s contention that the ‘system’ and the Batman lie to serve their own agendas. Dent will escape to let Gotham know the truth and to finish the job he started in the second movie.
This storyline would leave plenty of space for Batman to be up against someone like Black mask or Killer Croc while dealing with a twist on the copycat Batmen -a thief naming herself Catwoman.
If you step back and think of how a villian would operate in the real world as opposed to how real they are in the comic book world you’ll see the Nolan’s have given themselves a lot more choices than it seems.
Comment by howlingwlf — August 28, 2008 @ 12:20 pm
I like the idea of the Riddler as the primary villain. Catwoman would be a good addition, but the character does not have much weight to carry the movie, given her motives. I think both villains would have to be reinvented to be interesting and credible.
The riddler can work if he’s not done in an over the top manner. I have no problem with him being a bit screw-loose, but I think he needs to be portrayed as a serious threat, who is not just playing a game with everyone, but rather has some solid motives.
I think in an interesting twist, the Riddler shouldn’t be feuding with the Police by committing crimes, but perhaps trying to aid the Police and the city in trying to discover Batman’s identity, as well as putting batman through the gauntlet of riddles.
Back story would be important to touch on, but not excessively. It would be interesting if the Riddler were an ex government opperative, who worked in one of the intelligence agencies; a think tank type of guy. That gives him more credibility, because right away we know he is not only intelligent, but highly trained and skilled. I just don’t buy the Riddler being a random fruitcake who is very intelligent, and has nothing better to do than come up with riddles that have life and death implications.
I see Catwoman as a rogue, but naturally someone who lives for acquiring wealth and thrills. She could possibly be hired by the riddler for a large contract, that involves industrial espionage of Wayne Enterprises. I don’t know…
Of course, you would have Selena and Bruce get introduced and have the dual relationship. I think they should go a step further with their relationship, and make them fall in love. Then near the middle of the film, they discover each other’s identities and have to decide what more important: their love for each other, or their individual agendas.
For a plot twist, well, not really a twist, but Selena could be discovered as Carmine Falcone’s daughter. Actually, in “Batman: The Long Halloween”, it is implied that Selena Kyle is Carmine Falcone’s daughter. So, that could be cool.
Ultimately, the plot should be about Batman trying to continue to help Gotham, while trying not to get apprehended by the continuing pressure from the Police. A good idea, would be to have a new cop introduced who is charged with the task of leading a task force to capture Batman. This will be good for Jim Gordon’s character, because he knows that Batman is a hero, but at the same time, he’s the Police commissioner and his job is to uphold the law.
Anyway, I’m sure Nolan and company will come up with something a lot better than what I have mentioned. Guaranteed. I can’t wait until the next movie!
Comment by Jason — September 4, 2008 @ 5:44 am
hey i think Poison Ivy AND harley Quin should be in the next one ,,,if u read the commics the joker scares Harley sooo much she runs off and befreinds Ivy ,,,we havent had a femal villan for a while ,,,and to say plants r not scary or evil enuff is bull shit ,,, there r more plants that humans they would win lmao ,,,, and harley will bring back the joker the best villan out there … just think on it lol
Comment by alyivy — September 9, 2008 @ 9:41 am
Executives at Warner Bros. studios are re-releasing The Dark Knight next year in a bid to win the Batman movie an Academy Award.
Read more, view the Movie Trailer and comment on The Dark Knight at Walrus Films
http://www.walrusfilms.com/movies/the-dark-knight.html
Comment by Walrus Films — September 11, 2008 @ 2:04 pm
I believe that Nolan needs to do the story with Riddler, Mr. Freeze, Scarecrow. Riddler is great with the mind games and they can Freeze is always a powerful charchter. Those two alone would be great together now in the way that Nolan is making the Batman movies darker again. I can’t wait for The Dark Knight to hit DVD.
Comment by Josh — November 20, 2008 @ 4:18 pm
Ok, I think the Riddler could be done very well. I would love to see Catwoman, Hush, Azrael, Talia Al Ghul, Harley Quinn, and even Penguin or Poison Ivy if they were done seriously. You can still have elements of the powered villains if they are taken seriously. The same goes for Batgirl, and Robin. If taken seriously as a character they are an essential part of the Batverse that should be included. I love Johnny Depp but I’m not sure he would make a good Riddler. I think Megan Fox would make the purrfect Catwoman. I like the Hoffman idea for Penguin. How about Katee Sackhoff for Harley, and Tricia Helfer as Ivy. I would like to see the characters of Barbara Gorden and Dick Grayson introduced, not as their costumed alter egos, yet. You could lay the groundwork for future sequels. I see Anne Hathaway as a good Barbara/Batgirl.
Oh, and please, no Bane, Mr Freeze, or Clayface. These characters are just stupid.
Comment by Deadpool — November 30, 2008 @ 11:54 pm
How about Hugo Strange? A great, eerie mad scientist villain with a supernatural element, and a direct connection to Batman’s earliest, weirdest days. Not to mention a palpable threat with a modus operandi and lust for power almost as bonkers as the Joker’s. Excellent, gothic, pulpy stuff. Nolan’s Batman movies are top flight, but he tends to draw on the more recent elements of the mythology. Why not the great Steve Engelhart / Marshall Rogers era?
Comment by Glenn — April 20, 2009 @ 7:33 pm
The Script is right under everyones nose…
The city has been saved from the Joker
The city is hunting down Batman
Meaning that the police is preoccupied with the hunt for Batman
The Media gives negative publicity to Batman and the world watches
The mob is temporarily run by small time thugs nobody big…
A new player by the name of Bane sees this oppurtunity and comes in to take over leadership of the underworld…
-Bane does not have to be a maniacal CGI hulk figure he can be someone subtle, slightly above average physique, does not have to pump a secret solution into his veins, could use a high dosage steroid which he calls venom
-everyone is talking about gangs and gangsters, in Knightfall, Bane is a gangster who takes over the underworld, extremely smart and intelligent and has no mercy
Another character sees the Gotham PD distracted with the Bat and this new character Bane who is causing an upheaval in the underworld and enters, she is Catwoman, a simple subtle thief.
This also holds true to the comics because in the Knightfall series Catwoman does have a few encounters with Bane when he is the head of Gothams underworld. IF you need to spice it up some more you can throw in a third character who may be secondary to Bane and Catwoman… Black Mask. Black Mask has always gone after Bruce Wayne, he can discover that Batman = Bruce Wayne, and after Bane “breaks hehe i couldnt help it” Black mask then he finds out from him that Bruce Wayne = Batman
Now Bane is going after Bruce Wayne/Batman, Catwoman has been hurt by Bane and helps Batman dismantle Banes criminal empire
THEN OMG THIS ENDING WOULD BE A PERFECT WAY TO END A TRILOGY ABSOLUTELY PERFECT
Bane and Batman fight EXACTLY how the fight is in the Comic, they both duke it out on a reasonably high building, beating each other to a total pulp while the city watches on (this is to signify Batman becoming their hero once again) and Bane in his final ounce of strength breaks batman (or injures him very severley) and throws him down…. the police who have been holding their fire so as not to shoot Batman see him being broken and open fire on Bane, Bane = dead or injured and captured…. THE PEOPLE carry Batman to the ambulance, cutscene and dramatics follow, we find out he is in serious but stable condition and is recovering ANDDDDDDD then Commissioner Gordon talks to a secondary character or one of his cops and explains how his people will take over the city until Batman can return
PERFECTTTTTTTTT ENDINGGGGG TO THE TRILOGYYYY
Comment by JB — May 25, 2009 @ 4:37 pm
police chasing batman too distracted
mob has been taken over by black mask
bane comes in takes over mob, learns of identity from black mask since black mask is always after bruce wayne
catwoman is introduced as a subtle thief trying to bag some profit while cops are distracted
catwoman steps on banes feet and rips off his men
bane attacks catwoman
catwoman helps batman (romance scene?) .. batman begins dismantling banes gang
final showdown between bane and batman
bane breaks batman in front of everyone (just like in comic) and once he throws batman down, gordon and his men open fire
batmans fate is in the hands of the city, they decide to leave his mask covered. lucious fox and alfred take him away.. build new batcave etc. while he recovers, and while he recoveres jim gordon and gpd control streets. DONE wrap perfect trilogy
realistic characters, a menacing yet extremely intelligent bane, a slick and smart thief, a gangster with a black mask, simple, realistic and easy to make also holds true to the comics and DONE PERFECT TRILOGY.. if characters are portrayed to their roles in the comics then it will easily match Dark Knight or do better.
Comment by JJ — May 25, 2009 @ 8:30 pm
So why does everyone assume Rachel is dead? Her hair is blown by the percussion from an explosion… but from WHERE? From her letter to Bruce and her feelings for Harvey, his death – at the hands of Batman, aka, Bruce (who has already let Harvey take the rap once) – is the perfect fuel for revenge and this could tie in well with the storyline so far of misguided vengeance and misunderstandings and miscommunications and Rachel could know who Bruce is without him knowing who she is making for a gooey love tryst.
Or Johnny Depp. Batman can’t “be broken” in the films. This isn’t Marty Scorsese.
Comment by Clint — September 8, 2009 @ 2:39 am
Mr. Reese is not the riddler, the riddler has a name and it’s not mr. reese. It’s edward nigma. (E. Nigma) And you call yourselves batman fans…….
Comment by Christina — November 4, 2009 @ 11:25 am
i wouldnt call myself a major batman fan but i sure know a lot more than ordinary people but i doubt two-face will star in the next movie because in all the stories wether its a comic or movie etc. harvey dent/two-face is never in a batman story without the joker turning up somewhere. he can be in the movie if the director makes up his own story but i doubt that as well. i dont know who will be in the next movie but my opinion they should add smaller villian characters never portayed in movies like clayface, bane, scarecrow, killer croc, etc.
Comment by STT924 — July 25, 2011 @ 10:09 pm
they had some facts wrong in the movie. joker doesnt wear make-up he fell in toxins/acid while fighting batman as a different persona (i dont remember what it was), harvey dent didnt become twoface because of that oil and the fire he also fell in toxins/acid on one side (left). at least the changes were more realistic. i think it was a little stupid that two-face didnt have a black and white suit but a suit half burned
Comment by STT924 — July 25, 2011 @ 10:18 pm